Thank you to everyone who joined this evenings chat session.

tonyh entered the room.
Laurie: Hi Tony, just finishing my tea,
tonyh: Evening Laurie.  Looks like we will have to get the ball rolling.  How are you?  Got a very nice rejection from 'Womans Day' - AUS - this afternoon, but it is a higher paying market and therefore pretty choosy.  Never mind!
Maureen entered the room.
Laurie: Sorry, I am here, baby has decided to to settle as normal tonight so I'm a bit behind
Laurie: Hi Mo
Maureen: Hi
Laurie > tonyh: But it looks like you've had some success recently too
Maureen: Just had a brief communication from David - he's back in hospital and sends his appologies
Laurie: Ooh heck, I hope he's going to be ok
Maureen: me too - no details
Laurie: I know that some of our group can't make it tonight, but hopefully we may get a few visitors
tonyh: Hi Maureen. Nice to see you. Not sure what the topics might be for tonight.  Guess we will just play it by ear. I did have a couple of acceptances, but experience tells me that they are far more rare than the rejections!
Maureen: Hi Tony
Maureen: I'm helping to promote the 100 stories for Hiti book at the mo
Laurie: We have a few members who are not too hot with computers Tony, and I thought this might be one way to get them into the main chat sessions
tonyh: I was wondering about writing preferences among fellow writelinkers.  I enjoy short fiction but prefer article writing. What about you two?
Laurie > Maureen: How is that all going Mo? Not seen much of Greg recently either
Maureen: it's busy busy
Maureen: I do articles Tony along with the odd non-fict book but love writing for young children
tonyh: Yes. I was wondering about the Haiti thing also.  I didn't manage to get a story submitted but it would be good to know how it progesses.
Laurie > tonyh: I have a Novel on the back burner, I write poetry and have tried my hand at short stories and flas fiction
Laurie: that's FLASH fistion
Maureen: do either of you enter the comps on here?

tonyh: Did you find that you have come across editors who especially like what you do, Maureen? It seems that regular writing slots are especially desirable, though you have to still cast your net as wide as you can.
Laurie: I have an idea for an article on 'Elder Abuse' but I'm not sure how I want to write it yet
Maureen > tonyh: I write fairly regularly for Freelance Market News
tonyh: I am intending to enter the comps as time goes by.  I have entered the Wordswith Jam comp, and a couple of the comps on the Creative Competitor website.  I quite like comps.
Maureen: no need to query now so the ed must like what I send her
Wingnut entered the room.
Maureen: hi
Laurie: Evening,Wingnut, glad to see you here
Wingnut: Thanks. Hello everyone.
Laurie: Just talking about what type of writing we do.... feel free to tell us yours
Laurie > Wingnut: and how you are finding the site so far
Laurie > Maureen: How long have you been writing now Mo
Maureen: feels like forever!
tonyh: I used to do a regular slot for a mens mag in the USA.  They took 156 articles from me over five years.  The editor od 'ireland's Own' has used about 40 pieces, and I had a good thing going with 'nhs-exposed.com for a few years.  They used about 40 pieces too.  Some still on view, I think.  Not got any regular gigs again just yet but I am working on it.
Maureen: I think I've always dabbled
Wingnut: I used to write dark, horror type stories when I was younger, then life took over. I'm now trying to catch up on lost time, very rusty at the moment if that's the correct term.
Laurie > tonyh: Do you always do factual or have you done fiction as well
Laurie > Maureen: But rewarding I bet
Maureen: can't imagine not doing it
Maureen > Laurie: do you find it harder to get down to writing with the baby

tonyh: Did you find that you have come across editors who especially like what you do, Maureen? It seems that regular writing slots are especially desirable, though you have to still cast your net as wide as you can.
Laurie: I have an idea for an article on 'Elder Abuse' but I'm not sure how I want to write it yet
Maureen > tonyh: I write fairly regularly for Freelance Market News
tonyh: I am intending to enter the comps as time goes by.  I have entered the Wordswith Jam comp, and a couple of the comps on the Creative Competitor website.  I quite like comps.
Maureen: no need to query now so the ed must like what I send her
Wingnut entered the room.
Maureen: hi
Laurie: Evening,Wingnut, glad to see you here
Wingnut: Thanks. Hello everyone.
Laurie: Just talking about what type of writing we do.... feel free to tell us yours
Laurie > Wingnut: and how you are finding the site so far
Laurie > Maureen: How long have you been writing now Mo
Maureen: feels like forever!
tonyh: I used to do a regular slot for a mens mag in the USA.  They took 156 articles from me over five years.  The editor od 'ireland's Own' has used about 40 pieces, and I had a good thing going with 'nhs-exposed.com for a few years.  They used about 40 pieces too.  Some still on view, I think.  Not got any regular gigs again just yet but I am working on it.
Maureen: I think I've always dabbled
Wingnut: I used to write dark, horror type stories when I was younger, then life took over. I'm now trying to catch up on lost time, very rusty at the moment if that's the correct term.
Laurie > tonyh: Do you always do factual or have you done fiction as well
Laurie > Maureen: But rewarding I bet
Maureen: can't imagine not doing it
Maureen > Laurie: do you find it harder to get down to writing with the baby

tonyh: Did you find that you have come across editors who especially like what you do, Maureen? It seems that regular writing slots are especially desirable, though you have to still cast your net as wide as you can.
Laurie: I have an idea for an article on 'Elder Abuse' but I'm not sure how I want to write it yet
Maureen > tonyh: I write fairly regularly for Freelance Market News
tonyh: I am intending to enter the comps as time goes by.  I have entered the Wordswith Jam comp, and a couple of the comps on the Creative Competitor website.  I quite like comps.
Maureen: no need to query now so the ed must like what I send her
Wingnut entered the room.
Maureen: hi
Laurie: Evening,Wingnut, glad to see you here
Wingnut: Thanks. Hello everyone.
Laurie: Just talking about what type of writing we do.... feel free to tell us yours
Laurie > Wingnut: and how you are finding the site so far
Laurie > Maureen: How long have you been writing now Mo
Maureen: feels like forever!
tonyh: I used to do a regular slot for a mens mag in the USA.  They took 156 articles from me over five years.  The editor od 'ireland's Own' has used about 40 pieces, and I had a good thing going with 'nhs-exposed.com for a few years.  They used about 40 pieces too.  Some still on view, I think.  Not got any regular gigs again just yet but I am working on it.
Maureen: I think I've always dabbled
Wingnut: I used to write dark, horror type stories when I was younger, then life took over. I'm now trying to catch up on lost time, very rusty at the moment if that's the correct term.
Laurie > tonyh: Do you always do factual or have you done fiction as well
Laurie > Maureen: But rewarding I bet
Maureen: can't imagine not doing it
Maureen > Laurie: do you find it harder to get down to writing with the baby

tonyh: Did you find that you have come across editors who especially like what you do, Maureen? It seems that regular writing slots are especially desirable, though you have to still cast your net as wide as you can.
Laurie: I have an idea for an article on 'Elder Abuse' but I'm not sure how I want to write it yet
Maureen > tonyh: I write fairly regularly for Freelance Market News
tonyh: I am intending to enter the comps as time goes by.  I have entered the Wordswith Jam comp, and a couple of the comps on the Creative Competitor website.  I quite like comps.
Maureen: no need to query now so the ed must like what I send her
Wingnut entered the room.
Maureen: hi
Laurie: Evening,Wingnut, glad to see you here
Wingnut: Thanks. Hello everyone.
Laurie: Just talking about what type of writing we do.... feel free to tell us yours
Laurie > Wingnut: and how you are finding the site so far
Laurie > Maureen: How long have you been writing now Mo
Maureen: feels like forever!
tonyh: I used to do a regular slot for a mens mag in the USA.  They took 156 articles from me over five years.  The editor od 'ireland's Own' has used about 40 pieces, and I had a good thing going with 'nhs-exposed.com for a few years.  They used about 40 pieces too.  Some still on view, I think.  Not got any regular gigs again just yet but I am working on it.
Maureen: I think I've always dabbled
Wingnut: I used to write dark, horror type stories when I was younger, then life took over. I'm now trying to catch up on lost time, very rusty at the moment if that's the correct term.
Laurie > tonyh: Do you always do factual or have you done fiction as well
Laurie > Maureen: But rewarding I bet
Maureen: can't imagine not doing it
Maureen > Laurie: do you find it harder to get down to writing with the baby

Wingnut: Regarding the site, I'm still very new to it all and keep finding new things to interest me.One thing that interests me is the rating system used. if nobody rates a piece of work does it mean it isn't very good?
Laurie > Wingnut: If you want to direct a comment or relpy to someone in particular, click on their name in the top right hand box, it will give you a drop down box, select 'send message
Wingnut: Thanks.
Maureen > Wingnut: not everyone adds a rating - doesn't mean a thing!
Laurie > Maureen: Sometimes, but I think I've been more active on the site since she arrived... but my creative process has returned
tonyh: Hi Wingnut.  I started off nearly fifty years ago now wanting to emulate Isaac Asimov and write stunning science fiction. Did win a comp with one sci-fi story but not managed a book yet. I have had about 35 stories published around the world - as well as maybe 20 erotic tales - but concentrated more on non-fiction.  My better half tells me that I should write more stories,because they are good, but she is biased!
Maureen > Laurie: something we said?
Laurie > Wingnut: Not everyone feels comfortable leaving comments, but all comments are valid
Wingnut > tonyh: Better halves are usualy very wise.
Laurie: I have absolutly no idea what happened then, sorry
Laurie: chat just disappeared.... then I panicked... thought I'd lost all the comments and wouldn't be able post copy to group
Maureen: do you find it easy to write for US pubs, Tony?
tonyh: I think everyone should read and rate the work of others on Arena.  I love to see what springs from the imaginations of other authors, and I believe it is mutually beneficial to give each other honest opinions about work posted.  At least it helps the writers see where they are going wrong?
Wingnut > Laurie: I suppose I'm keen to see if other people consider my work of any value, as for the past few years I have only written for my own amusement.
Laurie > Wingnut: What made you pick Writelink?
Laurie > tonyh: But we do have some shy ods who still need some gentle coaxing
tonyh: Yes Laurie.  To be truthful, US pubs are, if anything, LESS demanding than thier UK counterparts.  The Americans seem to be possessed of a knid of naivity that is easy to appeal to.  Of all of my successes the US ones are far more numerous and on the main more financially rewarding.

Wingnut > Laurie: I suppose I'm keen to see if other people consider my work of any value, as for the past few years I have only written for my own amusement.
Laurie > Wingnut: What made you pick Writelink?
Laurie > tonyh: But we do have some shy ods who still need some gentle coaxing
tonyh: Yes Laurie.  To be truthful, US pubs are, if anything, LESS demanding than thier UK counterparts.  The Americans seem to be possessed of a knid of naivity that is easy to appeal to.  Of all of my successes the US ones are far more numerous and on the main more financially rewarding.
Laurie: To my mind, the more feedback you leave, means more people will feel inclined to read and comment on yours.
tonyh: Laurie.  That was my point also.  If you want people to rate your work, then rate thiers, Backscratching is much better when done together.
Wingnut > Laurie: I recently attended a Creative Writing course and it gave me the 'buzz' back.The work I produced during the course was reviewed in a positive light but I wanted to reach more peoples opinions, Writelink seemed the perfect place. I must apologise for my slow responses, it's my typing ability, not the computer.
Laurie: Slow speed not a problem.... it matches my reading spead
Maureen: and as you say, Laurie every comment is valid. I think sometimes people are afraid to say anythinf if they feel they're not experienced enough
Wingnut > Maureen: That's very true.
Laurie: I have never attended a creative writing course and I have learnt so much from members of this site
tonyh: Thanks Wingnut.  I shall tell my better half that you agree with in principal.  I do like fiction, so maybe I should allocate my time at half and half.
Maureen > Laurie: how's the novel going?
Laurie > Maureen: I felt like that to begin with, but when I thought about it, I read, so I could comment as a reader if nothing else. As my confidence grew, so di my ability to leave positive feedback
Wingnut > tonyh: If you have the skill to do both, it seems a shame not to. I,m still struggling to find a genre to work in. As I said previously, I enjoyed horror previously but at the moment none of my current writng is of that type.

tonyh: I did the comprehensive course with the Writers Bureau back in 1998/9.  I was awarded my 'Certificate of Writing Competence' after 15 months having sold work to the value of ten times the course cost by that stage, but then I was submitting about 15 - 20 pieces a month in those days, to pubs all around the world.  Much slower pace today, I'm happy to say!
Laurie: I've just had Sue's e-mails for a week, so I'm going to have a fesh look. I have a fourth chapter, but not sure that it can be used as is, now that Ch 1-3 are fairly tight
Laurie: And heading in a diferent direction
Maureen: did you write an outline?
Laurie: I did but not as detailed as Sue has suggested, Still want to do it as 'A book within a book' approach
Wingnut > tonyh: O yes .The Writers Bureau, I didn't achieve much with that myself.I obviously need  to work to a deadline and there was no pressure from them to submit work, so I tended to put it off, so to speak.
AndyJ entered the room.
Wingnut > AndyJ: Hello.
Laurie: Hi Andy
Maureen > Wingnut: that's what I 've been doing!
AndyJ: Hi all.
Maureen: hiya
Laurie: Just talking about our styles of writing , what we write etc
tonyh: I also have Sue's course on file, but I gave it to my better half, because right now she is trying to write a childrens book, and I thought it would help her.  I will get round to it in due course.  Taking your point Wingnut, I think we all have the skill to write many forms.  I love poetry and write it often, though I never before considered it as a saleable commodity.  To me, writing is just writing, so I am at home with it whatever I sit down to write, at least as far as short stuff is concerned.
AndyJ: 99% of what I write never makes it out of my notebook
Maureen: did you say you were writing a book, Andy?
Laurie: Why is that Andy
Laurie: Hey Mo I've just realised, for once we are out numbered by the gentlemen
Maureen:  :D
AndyJ: Yes but it's slow going. I took time out just to write poetry for a while to see if it could help my prose generally.
Wingnut > tonyh: Yes(short stuff) as you put it, I seem to be at ease with, I can't get my head around where to start with a novel.I have an idea about a love triangle and the Asian Tsunami.

Laurie > Wingnut: Try Sue's e-mail course. It may help... I've just read throught hen all tonight. When I get chance I am going to try and put them into practice
AndyJ > Laurie: Because most of it is rubbish - just ideas and stuff. Bits of everything eventually come together and something emerges but its like the iceberg. Most of it stays under the water.
Maureen > AndyJ: have you sold any poetry?
tonyh: Hi Andy J.  I would be horrified if I wrote things that were not going to be presented to an editor somewhere.  A famous scribe whose name escapes me once famously said - Anyone who writes anything that they don't want someone to buy is failing in thier duty as a writer - I wholeheartedly agree with him.  It may not go out to an editor at once, but I never compose anything I don't intend to sell to some unwary editor!  Am I wrong?
Wingnut > Laurie: How do I subscribe to that.
AndyJ > Maureen: No but I've only put it on the market this year. I've had some rejections but I'm trying to make sure there is always something out there.
Maureen > AndyJ: it's not an easy thing to sell is it?
Laurie > Wingnut: I'll just try and find where it is for you, hold on
AndyJ > Maureen: No. But I really only write it because I enjoy it - like doing a crossword. Selling it on merit would be nice but I think with poetry its about the journey more than getting there.
tonyh: In theory there is a huge market for poetry these days, and a host of websites devoted to the subject.  Just type poetry markets into a search engine and sit back.  I never have sold any myself, but maybe it would be worty of consideration.
Wingnut: Sorry if this has been asked before, but is any help given on the site for people trying to market their work. If you are an unpublished writer it is difficult to know where to go.
Wingnut: I've never attempted poetry.
Laurie > Maureen: Any idea where Wingnut can sign up to Sue's course, I've lost it
Maureen: umm was it on Sue's blog? I also signed up!
AndyJ > tonyh: If I wrote everything simply because someone else had to read it then my soul would be lost
Laurie > Wingnut: There you go Mo has the answer, go to Sue Kendrick's blog.
tonyh: Wingnut.  Not only is there a reasonable list of markets in the 'Articles' section of Writelink, but the same applies with search engines.  Type in 'Wrting Marketrs' or 'Writing magazines' and you will be bombarded with site details.  Freelance writer.com has a market database of 2300 worldwide markets  it costs £15 a year to get access to it.  Well worth it.  That is only one of many, believe me. Try it. You'll be amazed.
Wingnut > tonyh: Thanks.

Laurie > Wingnut: As for marketing your work, I think that there is something in the pipework for the site... but you could use the 'Classified section'
Wingnut > Laurie: Will do.
AndyJ > Wingnut: Once you find a decent website, check out their links. In no time at all you'll have a whole list of possibilities.
tonyh: It pays also to look for freelance writi8ng jobs on search engines.  Lots of them are low paying, it is true to say, but they coulkd be a starting point for some.  Also try small press mags.  They mostly do not pay for work, but as a beginner they offer the chance to at least see your worl in print.  I did this a lot in the beginning.
AndyJ: Has anyone sold much this year?
Wingnut > Laurie: I have probably looked in there and not remembered, I seem to become engrossed in reading the stories.
Laurie: haha
Maureen: just sold a piece to an Australian writers market
Laurie: What subject Mo
Maureen: writing a family history
Maureen: briefly!
Laurie: ??? why briefly
Maureen: similar bit accepted for Words with Jam out next month
Maureen: it's a huge subject
Laurie: Ahh, I think I've just signed up with them... or considered it
Maureen: it's very good
tonyh: Only sold two pieces so far this year, but then I have only just started up again after a break of several tears.  You have to build up a momentum with submissions. At the moment I have about a dozen things out under consideration by editors, but it can take months before youi hear anything, so in the maeantime you just keep going.
Maureen: that's the best way
AndyJ > Maureen: No. The best way is to marry a multimillionaire owner of a publishing house
Maureen: well, yeah
tonyh: Got to go temporarily.  I'm sat upstairs in my den, but I need a brew!
AndyJ > Maureen: Who also owns a distillery
Maureen: lol

Laurie: My claim to fame(cough.cough) is that some of my poetry has been read out during WI and a Corporate do. And permission has been sought to read one of them out at a ladies funeral service.... ;D
Laurie: Mines a black coffee Tony
AndyJ: Someone made a film of one of mine and stuck it on viral verse. That's a great site by the way. with some brilliant and approachable poetry.
Laurie > AndyJ: never heard of that
Laurie > Wingnut: do you have any other questions about the site
Maureen > Laurie: have you tried writing verse for those 'inspirational' greetings cards?
Laurie: No... but that is supposed to be a good market isn't it
AndyJ > Laurie: Google it. If you find the film of the Snowman doing Henry the Fifth it will be worth it.
Laurie > AndyJ: I'll have a look at that later, thanks
Wingnut > Laurie: Oh, I'm sure I have plenty but my mind has temporarily headed of to Phuket and another thought about my novel, sorry.It's a shame that some of the other newcomers are not benefitting from this.
AndyJ: How many folk out there keep a notebook?
Maureen > Laurie: lots of card companies take stuff - verses, jokes
Maureen > AndyJ: I have several
tonyh: Back again.  Believe it or not, the poem I last posted on Arena was the one that won me a nartional poetry comp back in 2002.  It was organised by 'Papermates'.  I wanted to see what people made of it. Entitled 'Love'.  Greetings cards make a really good market, so i am told.  If you can churn out that sugary stuff you can do OK for yourself.
Laurie: It's ok, I'll copy and paste it to the group forum.... if you all think this has been helpful we could make it a regular thing in addition to Sue's chats
AndyJ: I've always got one with me - they fill up in no time.
Wingnut > AndyJ: I do, I work for Royal Mail and I am always coming across characters. Don't expect to get your mail early in Leeds if I'm delivering.
Laurie: I'have one
AndyJ: best advice I was ever given was to keep a notebook and write about everything you see.
Laurie > tonyh: Hey, if it pays, I'm prepared to be pure honey
Laurie: I have a posty character in my book
AndyJ: It doesn't have to be sugary. Surely there's some 'adult' greetings cards.

AndyJ: It doesn't have to be sugary. Surely there's some 'adult' greetings cards.
tonyh: I think this could be really useful Laurie, as a regular event.  Say every other week on a Wednesday Night at 7.30? Or once a month.  I have enjoyed this evening because there were just enough of us that everyone got a proper look in.  That being so then yes.  I'm all for a regular meet.  How about the rest of you?
Maureen > Laurie: does he have a notebook?
AndyJ: I've got all the people I don't like in my notebook - that's where the Firewatchers came from
Maureen: I enjoy the chats even when they are hectic
Laurie > Maureen: Yes.... It's small, black and very full
Laurie: I do too.... and then there are the 'Lock ins'
AndyJ: Maureen's got a fireman in hers :) 
Maureen: I do?
Laurie > tonyh: I will have to co-ordinate with Sue but will let you all know by e-mail and group forum
Laurie: I will also put it up on the events section on the home page
Maureen > Laurie: I see the Spring Fever contest is in Events now too
AndyJ: Yep. Says he can't get out cos he's eaten all those peas and foody things you wrote about.
Wingnut > Laurie: Never ask a postie for his opinion on anything, he will keep you occupied for ages, or is that just me!
Maureen > AndyJ: that was Jeanne
Laurie: Funnily enough, my character has a regular stop on his round for a full english, different house each day
AndyJ: Oops
Laurie > Maureen: Yes, more visible
Maureen > AndyJ: does that mean she has my fireman also?
Wingnut: I have found tonight very useful, and would certainly enjoy regular events.
tonyh: .  Have to go now I'm afraid.  Things to get done.  Hope we get together again soon.  Remember anyone can drop me a line anytime.  Cheers.
AndyJ: If she's got two firemen that's just being greedy
Wingnut > Laurie: Is that a double meaning
tonyh left the room.
Laurie > Wingnut: Great.... looks like we got us a convoy....
Maureen: night Tony

Laurie: Night Tony
Wingnut: Bye Tony
Laurie: Full engish is a breakfast
Laurie: A bit of a lad in his hay day
Maureen: has he ever been in the fire service?
AndyJ: Has he ever been trapped in a notebook?
Laurie > Maureen: oh soo many jokes.... I've just bitten through my tongue
Maureen: lol
AndyJ: There's an off the wall story in there somewhere
Laurie > AndyJ: Sounds painful
Wingnut left the room.
Laurie: dropping like flies now
Laurie: Bye wingnut
Maureen: and Trevor isn't even here
AndyJ: I'm ok. Still got half a bottle of wine left
Laurie: with his 'old spice'
Maureen: never without it
Laurie: half a bottle left!!! what's wrong?
AndyJ: The first three were a bit stodgy
Laurie: lol
Laurie: you're forgiven
AndyJ: But I'm trying my hardest to be damned.
Maureen: does it help with the poetry?
Laurie: Not a bad chat session though, Gill sent me an e-mail but she has a time difference and I think she was here too early
Maureen: pity
Laurie: makes it colourful Mo
AndyJ: Sometimes - but I've not posted them on Writelink!
Laurie: It either helps with my spelling or helps my eyes adjust to the bad spelling

Maureen > AndyJ: too right - we're a sensitive lot
AndyJ: I  get some brilliant ideas for poetry when I've had a few - butthen I sober up
AndyJ: I have a confession to make.
Laurie: all ears
Maureen: spit it out
Maureen: we're nurses, you're okay
AndyJ: I let the dogs out for a pee when I started this session - and I've only just remembered they're still out here in all this blizzard.
Maureen: are thet frozen?
Laurie: frozen peas
AndyJ: No they're flatcoat retrievers
Maureen: that's STILL Jeanne
Laurie: poor babies
AndyJ: And they're back in the kitchen hogging the radiator
Laurie: and no doubt giving you the eye
Laurie: do you feel suitably guilty now
Laurie: they're very good at that
AndyJ: They've just gone into the living room and 'nosed' the cats out fro in front of the fire.
Laurie: lol
AndyJ: So the cats are giving me the eye.
Laurie: of course.... you could always put them out as well... no favorites then
AndyJ: I would but Roo's too old and gets arthritis with the cold and Piglets diabetic so we keep her where we can see her
Maureen > Laurie: Laurie - when you ttry to copy and paste a lot of stuff from here it doesn't always let you. I sometimes have to put half it and then 'edit' to add the rest.
Laurie: I know that feeling, my last cat reached the grand age of 22, and I couldn't have sent him outside in bad weather. I think the chat has gone well, so will look at having one every two weeks, and hopefully pick up some more new members along the way
AndyJ: Time for bed said Zebedee. See y'all later.
Maureen: night
Laurie > Maureen: Ok, thanks for that Mo, do you want it on the chat forum as well
AndyJ left the room.

Laurie: Night all
Maureen: yes, why not
Laurie: Ok will try TTFN thanks for coming
Maureen: I'll let you get off too
Maureen: bye
Maureen left the room.